Persecuting Catholics

Hello Mondabi, 

I am not sure if Catholic was in fact the first Christian religion.  John the Baptist?  He was going around baptizing people but I don't think he was "Catholic."  I think the reason some are saying that it is a cult is that the Catholic priests tried to keep the rites and rituals to themselves (all in Latin) so that they would have all the power and all the money.  They teach that you can pray for someone who is already dead and your prayers can get him into heaven.  If you don't accept Jesus Christ as your savior before you die you don't get another chance.  They teach that you need to pray to saints or confess to a priest.  God wants us to come directly to him with our needs, concerns, wishes, and anything we desire.  He will answer our prayers.  They teach that works will get you to heaven.  Accepting Jesus Christ is the only thing required to enter heaven.  Good works flow from having been saved and not the other way around.  They teach that you must give a percentage of your income.  Giving flows from a joyful heart that is greatful for the gift of grace and wanting to further the kingdom of God.  There are other things such as the extra books they believe should be in the Bible.  What Martin Luther (Lutherens) and Tyndale (printed the English Bible)did was revealed to the world that you didn't need to pay the Catholic church to get into heaven and the common man could read the Bible and understand it and they did not need the Catholic church to act as an intercessor to God.  The first Christians were disciples of Jesus.  The Catholic church tried, and was very successful for a long time, to hi-jack the simple truths of Jesus for their own profit, power, and benefit.   If you have any more questions I would be glad to respond.  I am not a fanatic that thinks it is a cult.  I think that there are certian things that are necessary to believe if you are a Christian. In those things we need unity.  In nonessentials we need grace and in all other things we need love.    Sincerely, dave

I am not familiar with the booklet to which you refer. I can respond to the remainder of your question, however. The reason that protestants and Baptists have problems with some Catholic beliefs is that all of these denominations believe that Jesus alone provides salvation and entrants into the presence of God. These denominations further believe that Jesus is our intercessor (John 14:6). For intercession we don't need a pastor, a priest, a deacon or the Pope. Praying to some saint defined and named by the church is not supported by scripture. Furthermore, praying to the mother of Jesus is not supported by scripture. The saints and His mother can do nothing for you. We can pray directly to the Father who gives forgiveness for sin directly. He also would direct us in any action we should be involved with regarding any sin of which we are asking forgiveness. Peter was not the founder of the faith, our faith, nor was he the first Christian faith. The only scripture of which I am aware that the Catholic religion uses to base their belief is Mathew 16:18-19. This is the 'keys to the kingdom' scripture. The most natural understanding of this passage is to see some special importance attached to Peter. The New Testament certainly attached some primacy to Peter. Peter is always listed first in any list of apostles. He was always in the innermost circle around Jesus. He preached the sermon at Pentecost. Many other times Peter seemed to be the one out front. On the other hand, there is no indication that Peter had any particular authority over the apostles. He did not send apostles; they sent him(Acts 8:14). James was the leader of the mother church in Jerusalem (Acts 21:18), not Peter. Paul could openly rebuke Peter at Antioch(Galations 2:11). There is no evidence that Peter was ever made bishop or pope over the whole church or that any special office was transmitted from him to another. It is unfortunate that the scripture that the Catholich church uses to justify the office of Pope and Peter as the first pope has been made a point of controvery. It is clearly 'proof-texting'. Jesus was the rock on which the church is built, not Peter. Peter is neither the head, not the founder of the church; Jesus is. The church rises or falls on Him. The church which Jesus promised to build is His church. I have many catholic friends. I have witnessed to many catholic people whom I did not know. In every case, they would not accept the basis of their salvation to be 'Jesus alone'. In every case their salvation was based upon what the Pope had to say. This is clearly in opposition to what Jesus said as reported in the Bible. I hold not feelings of animosity toward catholic people. I love them all. Their belief regarding Peter as the first pope and the Pope, in general, is misplaced and in the end will cause them great difficulty.

If I were the devil fighting a spiritual battle would I try to stop the man with an automatic or the man throwing sticks and stones... The Truth is that where there is the most Truth to inform us on how to live an overcoming life in this world which means a life that overcomes evil, that Church of Truth is going to receive a great deal more persecution than those Churches which have less truth and which are less deadly to satan. I will give you an example. Mary whom God (Father, Son and Holy Ghost) chose above all women in all generations to be the Mother of Jesus (the Son of God) said "All generations will call me blessed".  Catholics do this everytime they pray the Rosary asking her to pray for us. Now we know Mary entered eternal life and is in heaven because if she who was chosen above all women in all generations did not gain this, then who of us has a chance? And if she is in heaven where sin does not exist, then we know she can do no sin from there. If we can ask angels to pray for us, and she is higher than an angel, then we know we can ask the mother of Jesus to pray for us. If Mary petitions Jesus for something on our behalf and Jesus taught us to obey our parents, do you not think that Jesus Himself lives by his own rule? Thus she is one of the most powerful advocates we have to pray with us when we are in need. That makes her a mighty powerful weapon against evil and satan. So why then have nearly all other denominations of Christianity fail to recognize this? It is because satan has undermined their faith through promulgating the notion that we have the "right" to interpret Scripture for ourselves and do not have to rely on the method Jesus put in place to pass His teachings down to us through TEACHERS.

Eph 4: 4 There is one body, and one Spirit, ...5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, ...11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and TEACHERS; 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

If there is only ONE faith then why is there a different denomination on every street corner? Because these other denominations were protesting against the teachings of the Church, and that is why they are called PROTESTANT. The origins of Protestant denominations can only be traced back to the schism in the 1500 and 1600's when they broke away from the Catholic Church and they have continued to divide and subdivide since that time. (A house divided against itself cannot stand). But as you read in the passage I included there was a Prophesy that said Jesus would return when the Church was reunited in their understanding of Christ or in other words, when the whole body of believers returned to the original teachings. Only that prophesy that foretold the reunification, also fortold of the schism because the Church at that time had not suffered from men breaking off from the Church to start their own religions in the name of Christ.  So our separated brethren often labeled Protestants have been handed down a diluted portion of the Truth and thus it has became less harmful to satan than the full strength portion that remains in the Catholic (Universal) Church. So  satan isn't going to bother with those throwing sticks and stones as those who tromp on his head like Mary the Mother of God and the heirs of the authentic Apostolic authority endowed them by God.This topic can be quite upsetting to me because many of the poor Protestants of today have never once been told the origins of their church and many think falsely that their denominations, complete with beliefs can be traced back all the way to Christ, when in fact some denominations like the Assembly of God, or Quakers are only a little over 100 years old and their teachings originated with some man who refused to be subject to what was being taught as was handed down from Christ. It's not fair to them to be taught such deceit and yet their pastors learned the history of their Church in seminary... but then their pastors need a paycheck so they keep the dirty little secret of the schism in the dark. Jesus said In the last days many will be deceived because many will come in my name teaching Christ.  I apologize for such a lengthy answer but we can only make informed decisions about our faith if we are fully informed about the Truth and this Truth can be verified with nearly any encyclopedia. I hope this helps.

I read every word you have written and I appreciate your candor.  You sound very much like an evangelical Catholic  who believes in Jesus as the one providing salvation.  I never thought before of your example of praying to Mary in the same way that we ask our friends to pray for us.  I would not say that agree with you, but it is a consideration;  she is definitely not a diety.  I did not say anything about extra books of the Bible,  Macabbees being the only difference i am aware of.  Nor did I say anything about corruption, etc.  All in all,  based on this one encounter we don't sound like we're that far apart.