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Is Jesus God?

Isaiah 9:6

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Is Jesus God



Examination of the Verse: “For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us, and the government will rest on his shoulders; and his name shall be called ‘Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.’”
“The differences between the two English translations of the verse, shows a different understanding of the verse. Christians use Isaiah 9:6 as a proof text that the Messiah (Jesus) was one and the same with the Eternal Father (God). The rabbinic translation doesn’t take away from the person described, but states that he is “wonderful counselor of the mighty God”. What man or woman could be called a counselor to God? The person described in the verse is born as a child here on earth. It may even be that the correct understanding is midway between the two translations.”
“The Jewish understanding of the Messiah is that he is a man born here on the earth and that he will fulfill the prophecies, but that he is still a man and not God.”

“… and his name shall be called ‘Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God (El), Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.’”

What does the word El (God) mean in Hebrew? Does the word El in Hebrew refer to the mighty and true God alone, such as Jehovah? Let us see the definition of the word El (God).
(1) God, god-like, mighty one
(a) Mighty men, men of rank, mighty heroes
(b) Angels
(c) God, false god, (figments of the imaginations)
(e) God, the one true God, Jehovah
(2) Mighty thins in nature
(3) Strength, power

“Even the Jewish Targum (translation of part of the Bible in Aramaic) commentary on Isaiah 9:6 says Mighty God and not Mighty ‘judge’.

“In fact if one reads Ezekiel chapter 31 verse 11 we see that a tyrannical king is called mighty god: ‘Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Because thou has lifted up thyself in height, and he hath shot up his top among the thick boughs, and his heart is lifted up in his height; have therefore delivered him into the hand of the mighty one (?el) of the heathen.’”

“If one goes and consults the Hebrew one will find that the term used here (Ezekiel 31:11) is IDENTICAL to that of Isaiah 9:6.”
To complicate things further - for the Jews, how can all of this be reconciled with the text of Isaiah that reads, “The arrogance of man will be brought low and the pride of men humbled; the Lord alone will be exalted in that day, and the idols will totally disappear” (Isaiah 2:17-18). One can understand the riddance of the self-defied man, but does nothing to resolve the controversy concerning the "Mighty God"- the Messiah.
“Mighty God” translates the Hebrew El Gibbor. Literally this means “God of Might.” We know from Holy Scripture that “the Lord” – Jehovah – is the God of Israel. And Jehovah went on to say: “I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob.” – Exodus 3:6. And then in Isaiah 45:21-22 Jehovah is clear and emphatic that there is only one God – PERIOD! “…there is no God apart from Me, a righteous God and Savior; there is none but Me. Turn to Me and be saved, all you ends of the earth; for I am God and there is no other.”
Consider Isaiah 44:6-9: “This is what the Lord says- Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from Me there is no God. Who then is like Me? Let him proclaim it. Let him declare and lay out before me what has happened since I established My ancient people, and what is yet to come- yes, let him foretell what will come. Do not tremble, do not be afraid. Did I not proclaim this and foretell it long ago? You are My witnesses. Is there any God beside Me? No, there is no other Rock, I know not one. All who make idols are nothing and the things they treasure are worthless. Those who would speak up for them are blind, they are ignorant, to their own shame.”
“One of the most important rules when we attempt to interpret the Bible is to let the text speak in its plainest sense. In other words, as we read Isaiah 45:21-22, what is Isaiah attempting to explain to us? When he writes that besides Jehovah there is no other God, it becomes plain that he means to tell us that there is only one God. Jehovah Himself reiterates this in verse 22 when He announces I am God, and there is no one else. Apart from further indoctrination, no one would ever come to the conclusion that there is more than one God."
ONE GOD - Is (Jesus) the Messiah God?
Again, we reflect on the controversy that confronts us in the text of Isaiah.

“… and his name shall be called ‘Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God (El), Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.’”

“Just because “El” can be referring to people other than God does not negate the fact that God is referred to as “El”. “El” can be, and is used of Deity. Taken together with the objective reality that God is called “El” it is abundantly evident that the context of Isaiah 9:6 has Jesus as God. Also, the fact Jewish Targum commentary notes that the proper context of Messiah’s title is Mighty God, and he who lives forever.
“You (Jesus) are the Christ, the SON of the living God.”
God is SON to NO ONE. Yet, God is Father to everyone, for the phrase, “son of God,” was simply a way for the Jew to express themselves as one of God’s children. Jewish kings where called “the Son of God” in recognition as God’s chosen king of Israel.”
“During his coronation, the new king was anointed with oil, thus, the anointed one was called the Messiah in Hebrew or the Christ in Greek. To Christens, “son of God” implies divinity; to first century Jews, it was like saying, “your royal highness”. To Jews, it would be blasphemy to deify Christ.”

Term: Son of God
“For humans, the love between a son and his father was analogous to the love between man and God. In the Old Testament, the righteous man is God’s child whom God will deliver from the hand of his adversaries. He professes to have knowledge of God, and calls himself a child of the Lord.”
Why would it be blasphemy for Jesus to say he was the son of God? It is not the ultimate destiny for any man to be called a son of God. On the other hand would it not be blasphemous for any man (with the possible exception of the Messiah) to make himself out to be God? Notice:

John 10:24-38 “The Jews therefore gathered around him (Jesus), and were saying to him, ‘How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Christ (NOTE: "Mighty God", via text of Isaiah), tell us plainly.’ Jesus answered them, ‘I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in my Father’s name, these bear witness of me. But you do not believe, because you are not of my sheep. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me, and I give eternal life to them, and they shall never perish; and no one shall snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out
of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one (? "Mighty God"?).’ The Jews took up stones again to stone him. Jesus answered them ‘I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning me?’ The Jews answered him, ‘For a good work we do not stone you, but for blasphemy; and because you, being a man, make yourself out to be God.’ Jesus answered them, ‘Has it not been written in your Law, ‘I said, you are gods (implying that Israel’s judges were claiming authority as though divine beings on earth, clothing themselves with delegated authority to judges among the sons of Israel- entrusted with the administration of justice)’? ‘If He called them gods, to whom the word of God came (as the Scripture cannot be broken), do you say to him (the Messiah), whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’? ‘”
Lamb to the Slaughter
It become obvious that when the Messiah (Jesus) claimed the title it would be accounted as blasphemy, the same as if he had made himself out to be equal with Jehovah ("Mighty God"). Thus, in the mind of the Jews he, being a man, would make himself out to be a God as the Jews understood the term. This constituted rank heresy and blasphemy.
More Controversy
How can it be possible for the Messiah to claim the title and not be accounted as one who would raise his throne above the stars of God…to ascend above the heights of the clouds; to make himself like the Most High. The Christian faith hinges on Jesus being God, to the Jews it is the worst of heresy and blasphemy.
Term Messiah
The Messiah is a messenger of God, in that he makes God known through the personification of His (Gods) Word. In the past God spoke to us in many ways. He has sent angels, He has spoken directly, He has given visions and dreams and through direct prophetic utterance, many of these are recorded in the Bible. The Old Testament begins with God’s creation of the universe and continues by describing the mighty acts of God in the and through His people. It (the book of the Old Testament) closes about 400 years before the birth of Jesus.

Again, we reflect on the controversy that confronts us in the text of Isaiah.
“… and his name shall be called ‘Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God (El) [the embodiment of the Word of the Almighty God made flesh], Eternal Father, Prince of Peace.
Could it not be concluded that the “Embodiment of the Word of the Almighty God” is equated to the “Mighty God”?
In Word- the Messiah and God are the same. When others are called gods it signifies that they were either judges of Israel claiming authority as though divine beings on earth or ones who had some kind of tyrannical authority or status.

Jesus was called the “WORD OF GOD”, being the chief spokesman through whom God spoke. True Messiah, is the true personification- the embodiment of the “Word of God” - bestowed upon him though both honor and right of birth. He is the Living Bible of the New Testament.

(A Jewish Translation)
The Conflict Between Light and Darkness

John 1:1-5 “’In (the) beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.’”
THE WORD WAS GOD
THE WORD.- “The most prevalent image by which biblical writers refer to the collection of words that became our Bible is word. The Bible is “the Word,” specifically the Word of God. The implication is that the Bible exists through the medium of language, whether oral or written. It is further implied that this word is a communication, inasmuch as the purpose of words is to convey meaning to the understanding of the listener or reader. Finally, to speak of the Bible as the Word of God (as the Bible itself does repeatedly) is to imply that the Bible carries authority for a person’s life because of the authority of its human authors as spokespersons of God and because of the authority of the ultimate author, God Himself.” – Images of the Bible
(A Jewish Translation from a follower of Jesus)

(Continuing John 1:1-5) Verse 2 “’This One [the personified entity of communication] was in (the) beginning with God [the author and creator of the word- God Himself]. All things came into being through Him and without Him not even one (thing) came into being that has come into being. In Him was [the wondrous phenomena of] life, and the life [force of conscious intellectual activity: thinking, reasoning and formulating opinions and judgment] was the [enlightening and guiding] light of men, and the light [of God’s word of holiness and moral purity] shines in the darkness [the obscurity of ignorance and chaos], and the darkness did not overtake it.’"
MIGHTY GOD = Word of God
MIGHTY GOD = Word of God = Messiah = The Embodiment of the Ethos of God
A Living Bible


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1 helpful answer

No Jesus is not God. He is the Christ, your brother who goes before the throne of Grace and pleads every living soul case unto salvation. This is why no preacher or Minister as we know is saving any souls for they are already saved in Christ Jesus. God so love us he allowed the murder of the christ by those who perpetrated his laws and held the spiritual minds of those who serve him in captivity just as it is today therby we live in a confused state. We cant see nor can we hear for that only if we art chosen. Just as Christ for many are called but few art chosen. To be called to the Gospel is that of a hireling in many cases for that there is a church on every corner just like there is a liquor store but they wont practice the Gospel. That my friends is Kingdom Building the unified effort for the total relinquishing of sin and sin nature. The exalting of god people and his creation.   The uplifting of the nations of the earth and its generations. I come the poor and the brokenheated they too may have abundant life these are the words of my brother as instructed by the father.

God Bless

Posted 2009-10-16T13:13:26Z
Wisdom Site was invited by Yedda to answer this question.

 
25 helpful answers

Do not group things in life together, see them as individual.

A God son.  Have a great rest of your life.

Jay

Posted 2009-10-16T16:45:44Z
James H Tolbert was invited by Yedda to answer this question.

 
15 helpful answers

 

So I got me a pen and a paper, and I made up my own little sign. I said, "Thank you, Lord, for thinkin' about me, I'm alive and doin' fine."

 

Yikes you sure can "ask" a long "question".  In answer to your question I will state YES JESUS was is and forever will be GOD. So YES. As to trying to get someone else to understand this I will not waste time nor cast my peal before swine. But ktjrnysend I will tell you why I do not argue this point, although I will admit it is very good to understand. In Matthew 16 verses 13-20 Jesus asked the disciples, Who do men say I am? They answer and said John the Baptist ,Isaiah, Jeremiah or one of the other prophets. Then Jesus asked THEM who do THEY say He is. And Peter said thou art the Christ, the Son of the Living God. Then Jesus said, and ktjrnysend this is the part you must learn; Flesh and blood did not  reveal this to you. {Man did not REVEAL this to you} but His Father in Heaven had REVEALED  it to Peter. And this REVELATION which is the only REVELATION in THE Book of  THE REVELATION. <<singular found in the first three chapters. This REVELATION on this is what I am going to build My Church. Philip have I been with you all this time and you still do not KNOW that when you see ME you see THE FATHER. So even the disciples had a hard time understanding this. So I can not convince any one of the Oneness of the  Godhead. But if you seek Him He shall be found.  I and the FATHER are ONE. Is what Jesus said. So YES JESUS IS GOD. But I still LOVE thoes who do not agree, and I still will say those who have had a Born Again experience with Jesus; they are my Brothers and my Sisters in the Lord. And they are saved. Whether they understand the Godhead or not. Paul and John wrote to THE CHURCH about the GodHead so some would understand. Now look you made me be long winded. YIKES Maybe I just should have typed in the word Y-E-S ! I love you and all that read this and hope you will be BLESSED.  .....YES

Posted 2009-10-17T06:09:44Z
Michael was invited by Yedda to answer this question.

 

Ktjrnysend

Before we can use scripture to determine if Jesus is God we need to know who God is, 1 John 5:7 tells us. The Apostle John more than once referred to Jesus as the (Gk.) Logos of God. Based on John’s description of who God is, the Word (Logos: Jesus) is as much God as is the Father and the Holy Spirit. Emanu-el meaning “God with us” is the description Gabriel gave concerning Jesus: I will believe Gabriel before I will you. You have misinterpreted all of the scriptures you used; not knowing who God is and what was said about who the Messiah is. According to the Apostle John, God has a trilogy and Jesus (the Word, the Logos) is part of this trilogy. Therefore to say that Jesus is God is a correct assessment of who Jesus is. John’s  reason for writing his gospel was to establish that not only is Jesus the SON of God, but that He is God using the trilogy of who God is (God is the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit; 1 John 5:7)

Now concerning the scriptures, they are the inspired (infallible and inerrant) words of God written through men of God from Genesis through Revelation, this is referred to as “verbal-plenary” inspiration, where God spoken and men wrote. The word of God is not man’s opinion from which fault can be found, it is what God told them to write. To believe or write anything to the contrary of what I have written is misuse and misinterpretation of scripture and the original languages. Your dissertation is an opinion that is not correct exegesis. Satan has been doing this kind of thing since he deceived Eve; where he misused and misinterpreted what God said to Adam.

No need to send a rebuttal we both are convinced of what we believe is correct.

Samuel samuside@aol.com  10/17/2009

 

 

Does your answer to my posting mean you believe the way I do about this subject, because I understood your dissertation to imply you don't.

Samuel

 
DYK
7 helpful answers

Is Jesus God?  Is God Jesus?  Are they both the HolyGhost?  Is the Holy Ghost, both God and Jesus?  The answer is "dizziness".

John Adams had this to say to Thomas Jefferson:

"[In regard to the Trinity]; "Tom, had you and I been 40 days with Moses, and beheld the great God, and even if God himself had tried to tell us that three was one . . . and one equals three, you and I would never have believed it. We would never fall victims to such lies."

----------------------------------

 

 

 

 

Perhaps Mr. Adams didn't have all of the info?

So, the Father is God, and the Son is God and the Holy Ghost is God, and  these three Gods make one God.

Does the above nail it down?  Perhaps it is better understood
mathematically?  Let’s have a go:
 
a) Addition:  two plus one and you have one.  Each one is equal to himself and to the other two.

 b) Multiplication:  one X one equals three, and three X one equals
one.

 c)  Subtraction:  and if we take two from three, three are left.

Good solid math always clears things up, doesn’t it?
---------------------------------------------------------------
But maybe it’s not as clear as it could be.  Let’s just look at the official creed:

“One is the person of the Father; another is the person of the Son, and another is the person of the Holy Ghost.  Now the Godhead of the Father, and the Godhead of the Son, and the Godhead of the Holy Ghost is all one.”
(Note:  everyone knows what a “Godhead”is, right? so no need to explain it.)
---------------------------- 
“All three are in glory equal, and in majesty coeternal.  The Father is untreated, the Son is untreated, the Holy Ghost is untreated.”

(Could there be anything more plain?)
----------------------
“The Father is incomprehensible, the Son is incomprehensible, the Holy Ghost is incomprehensible.”

(Maybe this is the reason we know so much about the whole thing after 2000 years.)
--------------------------
 “Now, the Father is eternal, the Son is eternal, the Holy Ghost is eternal, but yet there are not three eternals, only one eternal. Also, there are not three untreated, nor three incomprehensible but-only one untreated, only one incomprehensible.”

(Okay.  I was getting lost, but this gets me back on track.)
---------------------------------------
“In the same vein, the Father is almighty, the Son is almighty, and the Holy Ghost is almighty.  Yet there are not three almighties, only one Almighty.  So, the Father is God, the Son is God, the Holy Ghost is God, and yet there are not three Gods, but just one God.”


--------------------------------
The Father is Lord, the Son is Lord, the Holy Ghost is Lord, yet there are not three Lords, but only one Lord.

(I’m glad it keeps reinforcing the ideas; I need that…)
-----------------------------
It is forbidden to think or say that there are three Gods or three Lords.  The Father is made of no one, not created or begotten.  The Son is from the Father alone, not made or created, but begotten.  The Holy Ghost is from the Father and the Son, not made nor begotten, but proceeding…

(Just when I was startin’ to get it, they throw in proceeding!)
----------------------------
Let’s see if I can sum it all up:

So, there is one Father, not three Fathers.  No, wait, there are three Fathers.  One Son, One Holy Ghost, but three Fathers.  But wait, if they are all ONE, then why can’t there be three Sons, too? And why can’t there be three Holy Ghosts?

 My worst fears—I may not have gotten it! 
-------------------------------
Let me try again:  In this Trinity there is nothing before or
afterward, nothing greater or less, but the whole three persons are co-eternal with one another, and co-equal, so that in all things the unity is to be worshiped in Trinity, and the Trinity worshiped in unity.

 

There!  I bet if John Adams and Thomas Jefferson had been privy to all of this, they, too, would have been Christians.  But, wait, maybe they were privy, and THAT's why they weren't Christians??

 

 

 

 
19 helpful answers

If God is with us, who can be against us?

Yes. 1st. John-1:1   In the begining was the word and the word was with God and the word was God. Nothing was made without Jesus. Father ,Son, Holy Spirit; One God.

So many times Jesus said that the Father and Him were One. When the Rabbis in the temple question Jesus, He said -Before moses was I Am.  Even the Jewish people should had known by those words that He was God. They did not get it.

Posted 2009-10-22T05:28:56Z
Diaz Cordova was invited by Yedda to answer this question.

 
91 helpful answers

And He hath made my mouth like a sharp sword;  in the shadow of His hand hath He hid me,  and made me a polished shaft;  in  His  quiver  hath He hid me---Isaiah 49:2.

And Jesus said "Who hath seen me hath seen the father"<> "no man cometh to the father but by me"<> I am the door<> I am the way<>WHY?/? God came to redeem us fron satan by His Blood, Who's Blood?/? Gods Blood< HUH? God spoke the seed of God into Mary and she bare His son, 'Himself' as flesh as He promissed in the Garden. now can you see it? the answer is only one and It is yes to the question is Jesus God? 

Posted 2009-11-16T17:21:50Z
richard was invited by Yedda to answer this question.

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